Hacked Gadgets Forum

May 9, 2009

DIY Gas Hydroxyl – Hydrogen Supplemented Fuel

at 7:00 am. Filed under DIY Hacks, Electronic Hacks

 

We are all trying to save some money these days when jobs are scarce and gas prices are high. 9w2bsr has built a custom PWM system to control the Hydrogen Generator, it attempts to maintain a constant current to the system. The Gas Hydroxyl system has been installed into a 3 year old Perodua MyVi and should increase its gas millage. I look forward to seeing what the results are.

"Some of you already heard about the hydrogen supplemented fuel where tiny amount of hydrogen is being feed to the petrol/diesel engines. The hydrogen is typically generated using a simple electrolysis process where current is passed through water to split it into hydrogen and oxygen gas. Some call this gas hydroxyl rather than hydrogen because it also contains oxygen."


 

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16 Responses to “DIY Gas Hydroxyl – Hydrogen Supplemented Fuel”

  1. Per Jensen Says:

    When do people realise, that if you get more “energy” out of Electrolyses than you put into it ?. If you could do that, you would have a perpetual motion device.

    You CANNOT get more energy out of a device than you are putting into it – it’s common knowledge.

    The power that he uses for electrolysis is coming from his car battery, which in turn gets it power from the Alternator – each step has power losses – he would be better just to mount an electrical engine on the alternator belt and get that to boost the car. Then you would have a boost, but only as there is enough power from the battery – when that is run down the alternator has to load the engine again to recharge it – result: nothing won at all.

  2. Farle Says:

    Well hey Per, I guess if he charged a battery using solar/wind/etc to power the device that it would be saving on gas, provided the weight of the system+ battery was taken into account.

    I don’t think these devices are bad if you rig it up right, but people are idiots and idiots will probably install this in false hope of boosting their mpg.

  3. antonio Says:

    Per Jensen: you’re so right i see people installing kits like this in their cars and trying to convince everybody that the law of conservation of energy is wrong. Ehh

  4. Sean Says:

    Oooh! A preignition generator.

    About the only thing this can do is help the flame front in the combustion chamber propagate faster as the free hydrogen and oxygen catches fire. Something that in a gasoline engine is known as detonation. Which in newer vehicles with computer engine control, results in retarded ignition timing to compensate so you don’t get the knock.

    And in enough quantity if you really are producing enough hydrogen and oxygen, possibly will start compression igniting which results in preignition and engine damage. So if you have enough hydrogen going in and the engine starts sounding like someone’s hitting the engine block with a sledge hammer, immediately shut it off and recalibrate.

    Any fuel mileage changes will not be due to the added fuel content from the hydrogen and oxygen. The heat content from the amount released by this system barely adds to the heat released by the fuel and the energy put into splitting out hydrogen and oxygen far exceeds the heat released by burning it.

  5. Jason Says:

    If this idea had any chance of working. The Hydrogen Generator would have to be connected to a separate bank of batteries. These batteries would have to be charged prior to any road trip, and the Hydrogen Generator would stop working when the battery bank went dead. The battery bank would always have to be charged from a source separate from the engine, ie. a battery charger plugged in to the wall. But I think that the additional weight of the extra batteries would cancel out any benefit of the hydrogen.

  6. Rob Says:

    They even did an episode of MythBusters that showed how these systems don’t do anything. As was said before, you’re not generating any more energy than you’re putting into it, if this does make the engine run any more efficiently, it’s at the cost of additional strain on the alternator, which should take care of any added efficiency

  7. Bill Says:

    The idea is not that you get more energy out of the hydrogen than was put into producing it. The idea is that the hydrogen effectively raises the octane rating when mixed with the gasoline. This allows you to run a more aggressive timing and/or increase the compression ratio of the engine, which gives you better mileage.

    This is the idea. I don’t know how effectively it works and if it’s worth the trouble and money, but it has been done.

  8. Jehu Says:

    When will people realise that they shouldn’t post a comment about something they know nothing about!

    You really do not know what a hydroxy booster does.

    I’ll try to make it as simple as possible for you all.

    A system like this does not try to attain overunity. Yes this is not getting something for nothing.

    How is works is just to make the fuel (petrol, gas, whatever) burn more effeciently. That’s all. Yes, you take a little bit of power away in the form of electricity to power the booster, but these losses are recovered by the extra power released from the fuel that would otherwise have been wasted by going out the exaust.

    It is not overunity, perpetual motion or anything like that. It just makes it more effecient.

  9. eric Says:

    Some people are just hopelessly hopeful at breaking that darned first law of thermodynamics.
    Electrolysis is horribly inefficient. The energy required to break the chemical bonds is significantly higher than any energy you could get out of a reaction. Also, I’m glad to see the “hydrogen economy” movement dying down. I’ve done much research into fuel cells, more specifically hydrogen, methanol, bio, and aluminum-air fuel cells. What I can tell you is that hydrogen fuel cells have an absolutely pitiful power density, and methanol cells have about 3x that (so, slightly less pitiful).
    Don’t get me wrong, fuel cell stacks have great applications in backup power and alternative energy for houses and large buildings, but they suck at anything mobile.
    Solar cells create a pathetic amount of energy as well. Again, great for situations where lots of space and lots of weight are not an issue, but in a car you desire *lower* mass and higher energy.

  10. Andrew Hooper Says:

    Yep, seems that this keeps doing the rounds, there are easier ways and much simpler things to try. If you really want to use electricity why not just produce O3 andfeed that into the intake. However something that seems to be lost in technology was preheating the fuel before feeding it into the carberator. Fuel Vapor is far more volitile than Atomised Fuel that is released from Injectors or Jets. Years ago I remember there was a motorcycle that ran from almost any form of fuel, The fuel was run into a preheating system attached to the exhaust.
    I cant remember how the thing was started but guessing it had some form of heating system to kick things off.

  11. gtrdude Says:

    I bet there is a patent for preheating fuel before being fed to the intake. I bet you that a fuel company owns it and that it’s probably filed in a big round container somewhere.

  12. Ray Says:

    Build your own from scratch.

    Find out how for free here: http://autofuelsaving.com/info/11/building-oxy-hydrogen-generators-using-fruit-canning-jars/

    Read all of the comments.

    Get your electricity from wasted engine heat! This bypasses the alternator and gets rid of the perpetual motion device arguments.

    Google: “automotive thermoelectric generator” you will find some information you need. Read these sites:

    http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/techinnovations/2008-08-11-tailpipe-exhaust-power-gm_N.htm
    http://www.tegpower.com/products.html

    Thermoelectric generators are the cutting edge technology of the automotive future. The automotive industry will use them. The last site has a bolt on device. At this point it’s basically experimental.

  13. Ray Says:

    An interesting electrolyte. Read this: http://www.rsc.org/chemistryworld/News/2009/July/02070902.asp

    Also, consider using graphite felt for your electrodes. Graphite is electrically conductive and inert. Look here: http://www.waleapparatus.com/catalog.asp?prodid=548618&showprevnext=1

  14. David Says:

    @Farle who wrote: “Well hey Per, I guess if he charged a battery using solar/wind/etc to power the device that it would be saving on gas, provided the weight of the system+ battery was taken into account.
    I don’t think these devices are bad if you rig it up right, but people are idiots and idiots will probably install this in false hope of boosting their mpg.”

    Better off charging the battery using wind power and remove the charging generator from the vehicle thus saving energy by not charging the battery than to run the battery flat by making hydrogen by electrolysis.

    Every time you perform a conversion you get a loss.

    Why do:

    Wind power -> battery -> hydrogen -> propulsion.

    when you can do:

    Wind power -> battery -> less load on engine. (less propulsion required)

    /Cheers

  15. Per Jensen Says:

    Well if we pursue the wind power charging the battery scheme, yes, you could save gas by disconnecting the alternator from the belt when the car is running, and let the battery discharge into the headlamps and other electronics in the car, and then recharge the battery when you come home – you you won’t get many miles before the battery is exhausted. This way the alternator wouldn’t put the extra load on the engine, hence solar/wind powered electronics in the car.

    The same way you could charge an extra battery at home, put it in the car and let that drive your electrolysis apparatus, and get the boost that way, but i’m not really sure that it would boost anything – the electrolysis-apparatus and battery weigh in too, taking some extra gas too…

    A simple way to boost your engine would to mount water-injection on it. Lowering the temperature in the combustion chamber and manifold leads to increased engine power, and better combustion. Ever noticed how your gas-driven car has more oomph and power when in cold and damp weather ? That’s why. Water injection is cheap, and only requires some tap water. Some older SAAB models even had this fitted as a factory option.

    // Per.

  16. Peter Says:

    If that’s the case explain a magnet fool all you small minded people you may as well be sheep

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